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> Release candidate of plop with USB support
jaclaz
post Oct 6 2007, 10:24 AM
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Finally it has been released (IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/thumbsup.gif) :
http://www.911cd.net/forums//index.php?sho...c=20436&hl=

http://www.plop.at/de/bootmngrusblog.html
http://www.plop.at/bootmanager_en.html

jaclaz
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Nuno Brito
post Oct 6 2007, 12:12 PM
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What are the advantages of support to USB mass storage devices?

Does this mean it can replace GRUB on a computer to recognize USB disks?

Or can it be installed on the USB disk itself?


-------------

It also seems to come included with an internal hex editor to modify MBR - nice for quick experiments. (IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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jaclaz
post Oct 6 2007, 01:23 PM
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Theoretically it should provide from booting from USB devices even on machines which BIOS does not allow it.

i.e. it provides internally a USB stack/drivers, so that you do not need (like grub4dos or AFAIK any other bootloader) to rely on BIOS services.

jaclaz
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ktp
post Oct 7 2007, 10:01 AM
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OK I play with it few minutes using QEMU/VMware.

It is a boot manager, requiring to write to MBR of your hard disk.
Of course it is not useful to install it to USB key (I believe it refuses to by conception).
Once installed (I guess, no real try) it can boot USB devices using built-in OHCI/UHCI (USB drivers), so effectively
it is useful for old BIOS that cannot directly boot from USB.

Unfortunately it requires an installation (write to MBR). I would prefer a solution like Smart Boot Manager
that can be used "on the fly" (either from floppy, from diskette image, from ISO image or CD) without
requiring installation. Smart Boot manager is useful previously to allow booting from CD (for old BIOSes not supporting this)
by booting first from diskette (or from diskette image, or of course from hard disk).
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jaclaz
post Oct 7 2007, 10:42 AM
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QUOTE (ktp @ Oct 7 2007, 12:01 PM) *
It is a boot manager, requiring to write to MBR of your hard disk.


For the record, it also writes to a number of hidden sectors, (i.e. code is not contained in 512 bytes).

But the GOOD thing is that it provides a "low-level" USB stack, AFAIK it is the first of such code being around, the only meaningful test would be on real hardware without BIOS support for USB booting.

Another interesting test could be to install it to a (very small) HD image, saved on main hard disk and chainloaded by grub4dos.

If it works this way, you have a way to boot from USB on elder hardware without modifying the MBR of your "normal" hard disk.

jaclaz
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Alexei
post Oct 7 2007, 03:39 PM
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I'm rather (IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/confused1.gif)
If BIOS can read MBR it can read USB.
If BIOS can read USB, why use "low-level" USB stack?
In fact I solved USB Booting problem a while ago, but documentation, diagnostic utility, and installer took some time.
The last (rather serious things) are to make proper license agreement and find right e-business provider (IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
I'll let you know when it becomes available (IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

BTW (from http://www.plop.at/de/bootmngrusblog.html ):
QUOTE
Bad news: Something stange happens while testing the USB device booting function. On desktop pc's it works but on laptops it doesn't work. I don't know whats wrong.
(IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/roll1.gif)

(IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/cheers.gif)
Alexei
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ktp
post Oct 7 2007, 05:46 PM
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QUOTE
jaclaz
Another interesting test could be to install it to a (very small) HD image, saved on main hard disk and chainloaded by grub4dos.


I am willing to try this. Could you post some details? fsz command, .pln content, ptedit32 HDD characteristics and the entry in menu.lst
to chainload the image from grub4dos.

I tried with a small HDD but I cannot make vdk mount it with partition, even after ptedit32/mbrfix. It still sees it as FLAT.

I already has an HDD image with plop installed, but it is big (2 GB). But what I miss is the menu.lst entry.
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jaclaz
post Oct 7 2007, 06:17 PM
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@Alexei

The idea should be to install plop on the MBR and hidden sectors of the internal hard disk of a PC that has NO provisions in BIOS to boot from USB devices.

The PC thus boots "normally", then through the use of plop internal "stack" or whatever, you should be able to chainload the MBR (or bootsector (IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) ) on the USB device.

As ktp suggested, it should do for USB devices what Smart Boot Manager (and BCDL (IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) )did for PC which BIOS did not support CD-ROMs.

@ktp
As soon as I have some time I will post the minimum sizes for HD images to be mounted by VDK (I'm working on this right now for my MKIMG feature of MBRbatch.cmd).

jaclaz
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Alexei
post Oct 7 2007, 11:13 PM
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QUOTE (jaclaz @ Oct 7 2007, 11:17 AM) *
@Alexei
The idea should be to install plop on the MBR and hidden sectors of the internal hard disk of a PC that has NO provisions in BIOS to boot from USB devices.
I see now, thanks. BTW, does it have an option to use floppy as "initial boot device".
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Alexei
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Alexei
post Oct 7 2007, 11:17 PM
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QUOTE (jaclaz @ Oct 7 2007, 11:17 AM) *
@Alexei
The idea should be to install plop on the MBR and hidden sectors of the internal hard disk of a PC that has NO provisions in BIOS to boot from USB devices.
I see now, thanks. BTW, does it have an option to use floppy as "initial boot device".
(IMG:http://www.boot-land.net/forums/style_emoticons/default/cheers.gif)
Alexei
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